00;00;00;01 - 00;00;15;29 Sean Ashcraft Support for Pop of Culture comes from Stallings Wealth Management. Daniel Stallings, financial advisor, securities and advisory services offered through Cetera Advisors, LLC. Member, FINRA/SIPC, a broker/dealer and registered investment advisor. Cetera is under separate ownership from any other named entity. 00;00;16;01 - 00;00;26;17 Jen Blackmer This week, on Pop of Culture, Scott Simon has a new book about the role pets play in our lives. It's both funny and unexpectedly moving. 00;00;26;20 - 00;00;35;13 Kara DuQuette We'll also hear from the artistic director and principal conductor of Orchestra Indiana. He has an original work in their next concert. 00;00;35;16 - 00;00;39;16 Jen Blackmer And will celebrate Mother's Day, coming up. 00;00;39;18 - 00;01;06;13 Luke Jones Support for Pop of Culture comes from Stallings Wealth Management and from you. You may have heard about large gifts to NPR. Those donations are important, but they don't bring back the funding to IPR. Your support pays for the programs you rely on, especially local programs like this one, and the people, like me, who create them. Pop of Culture exists for you and because of you. 00;01;06;16 - 00;01;13;09 Luke Jones Give today at Indiana Public Radio Dot Org. 00;01;13;12 - 00;01;18;15 Jen Blackmer From Indiana Public Radio, this is Pop of Culture. I'm Jen Blackmer. 00;01;18;17 - 00;01;25;23 Kara DuQuette And I'm Kara DuQuette. Later this hour, we celebrate Mother's Day in the U.S. by going inside of bones. 00;01;26;00 - 00;01;41;15 Jen Blackmer But before that, you know, our first guest, because he's Scott Simon, the voice of Weekend Edition Saturday has a new book out called “Ulysses S. Cats and Other Animals I Have Known,” and he joins us now. Welcome to Pop of Culture, Scott. 00;01;41;18 - 00;01;44;02 Scott Simon Very good to be with you. Thanks so much, Jen. 00;01;44;04 - 00;01;55;03 Jen Blackmer Well, throughout your book, you refer to our animal friends as “running mates,” which is a term which has a lot of connotations, as you know. Where does that term come from? 00;01;55;05 - 00;02;19;06 Scott Simon You know, I'm glad you mentioned that because I initially I wrote most of the book under the assumption that would be the title. And and and then my fine publisher said, “Nah, people will think it's political. We can't do that.” Running mates, Steve. They take us through life. They're alongside, they're under our arms. They are often on our pillows, alongside of us at all stages of our life. 00;02;19;08 - 00;02;26;12 Scott Simon They they share so much with us, and, and we with them they're they’re running mates. We take each other through life. 00;02;26;15 - 00;02;45;29 Jen Blackmer Yeah, they really do. And we learn so much about the running mates in your life. And, in fact, there is a full on society. Not just of running mates, but a full on society of beings that resides on your porch. A community that your older daughter refers to as, “The Slimons.” So who exactly are The Slimons? 00;02;46;02 - 00;03;07;01 Scott Simon The Slimons, and I I defer to my older daughter's creativity in that one, are is the is the worm for the community of worms that we keep on our balcony. It's a worm bin. It was my wife's idea. And, each and every worm, I don't mind telling you is named after a local public radio station. 00;03;07;06 - 00;03;09;18 Jen Blackmer Yes, I got that. 00;03;09;21 - 00;03;36;09 Scott Simon And including IPR. So, you know, I, I lift the bin with my wife every now and then, and I say, “Hello, KQED. Hello, WBUR. Hello, WBEZ. Hello, IPR. Hello, WHYY.” And they, you know, they wiggle back. And I must say, I was not I was not keen on this idea. But I've become very fond of the worms. 00;03;36;09 - 00;03;55;10 Scott Simon It's hard. It's hard not to develop some feelings of attachment for them. And, you know, and I, I mean, we feed them leftovers, and the worms sometimes taunt me by saying, “Oh, yes, we might be slimy, but really, Scott? What are you doing for the environment?,” because worms do a lot for our environment, of course. 00;03;55;13 - 00;04;23;29 Jen Blackmer Absolutely. And the conversations that you have with your worms and with your your animal friends, you really do a lovely job in this piece of talking about that relationship and this, this tension, I guess, that we feel to either anthropomorphize the animals and maybe speak, think for them. But you describe this communication form as almost a literary process, right? 00;04;23;29 - 00;04;26;15 Jen Blackmer Can you expand on that a bit? 00;04;26;18 - 00;04;49;07 Scott Simon Yeah, because I think it is a literary process in the sense that we, we empathize, we impute, we infer, and and we create dialog in a language we can understand just as, you know, we have to communicate with them in a language they can understand. I think, Jen, you might be referring to the fact that that, what can I tell you? 00;04;49;07 - 00;04;55;23 Scott Simon It's a special responsibility I have in life. I am our animal’s interpreter. 00;04;55;25 - 00;04;56;16 Jen Blackmer Yes, exactly. 00;04;56;17 - 00;05;17;25 Scott Simon So for example, when we are walking, my wife and I are walking her French poodle, Daisy, along the river in the morning, Daisy just goes wild about human attention, human companionship. And she just begins to jump, and people begin to pet her, and and I will I will speak for Daisy in having her say, “I'm cute. I know I am cute. 00;05;17;28 - 00;05;46;24 Scott Simon You think I am cute? You will pet me. Oh, does that feel good? Does that...” I, you know, my wife, who is French, finds my representation of Daisy's French accent to be inauthentic, right? You know, she's entitled to her opinion. Our family was out in California a couple of years ago and at a barn, because our oldest daughter is very much works in barns. 00;05;46;27 - 00;06;10;15 Scott Simon They they met a pet psychic, and who work with horses. Horse psychic, I guess we should say. And so her daughters thrust Daisy into her arms. It must be said, according to them, Daisy was immediately relaxed entities in their arms and, they they said to the pet psychic, “Ask Daisy what she thinks about the voice that our father does for her.” 00;06;10;17 - 00;06;25;15 Scott Simon And the pet psychic, like, leaned against Daisy's forehead and leaned back and said, “Well, Daisy says that obviously doesn't sound like her, but your father enjoys it, so she doesn't mind.” That is such a brilliant answer, and I think it might it might also be true. 00;06;25;17 - 00;06;31;26 Jen Blackmer It's very true. And I mean, for for our listeners, Daisy is a French poodle. Yes? 00;06;31;28 - 00;06;32;09 Scott Simon Yes. 00;06;32;09 - 00;06;33;02 Jen Blackmer So of course. 00;06;33;04 - 00;06;58;14 Scott Simon That's that's why she would have the accent just as as, our we had a cat previously named Leona who had, been with, who'd been in the household of three interns at the British embassy. And then when they left went through, a bathroom window was discovered in the alley. The agreement we made between the British embassy is that we would we would take on Leona, who was ours for, I think, 14 years. 00;06;58;14 - 00;07;01;20 Scott Simon But we would have we had to rear her as a British cat. 00;07;01;23 - 00;07;03;19 Jen Blackmer Of course. 00;07;03;22 - 00;07;09;00 Scott Simon And we took this very seriously. We put pictures of David Beckham over her food bowl. 00;07;09;02 - 00;07;10;03 Luke Jones 00;07;10;06 - 00;07;13;25 Scott Simon You know, we tried to observe Boxing Day. We, we, you know, we and. 00;07;13;25 - 00;07;17;10 Jen Blackmer She's a, she's a, she's a Man United fan, apparently. 00;07;17;12 - 00;07;41;06 Scott Simon Yes. Yes. Man United matters for when we travel overseas. And, I must say, my wife being French, there was a little “War of the Roses” tension at first. But they got over that. And, of course, I would help Leona communicate in the morning. You know, Caroline would say, “Well, Leona, darling, are you hungry?” And Leona would say, “Right. Right. 00;07;41;09 - 00;07;53;20 Scott Simon Oh, a little scratch over here, please.” Leona would call her, “French Lady.” I should explain, too, one of the most touching, you know, because, as you know, this book ranges all around. I talked about pets during the Siege of Sarajevo. 00;07;53;23 - 00;07;55;09 Jen Blackmer Yes, absolutely. 00;07;55;12 - 00;08;32;17 Scott Simon Marjan the Lion in the Kabul Zoo during during that particular war. But I'm still moved when when I think about our late cat, Leona. It was when our daughters were much younger, and she would see each of us off into slumber every night. We would take our youngest daughter, Paulina, into her bedroom, and Leona would go in there and curl up with her until she fell asleep A little while later, half an hour/hour later, would take our older daughter, Elise in. Leona would curl up with her until Elise had fallen asleep and then, finally, Leona would come out and curl up with us as 00;08;32;18 - 00;08;39;17 Scott Simon Caroline and I read or watched something, and then we would bring her in in our arms to, to go off to slumber together. 00;08;39;22 - 00;09;01;08 Jen Blackmer Yeah. The the animals are so important in all aspects of our lives. And you mentioned the the Sarajevo and Kabul and you even mentioned Mississippi after Katrina. And how do you how do these stories of these less than ideal circumstances inform our everyday interactions with the animals in our lives? 00;09;01;10 - 00;09;36;12 Scott Simon Well, I think these unfortunate, unfortunate, these tragic circumstances of war and loss make us realize that the animals in our lives are part of our family. I don't mean to compare them to any other member of the family, but we cherish them. We don't want to say goodbye. And, you know, the, the laws were changed. Evacuation orders were changed following Katrina because they realized a lot of people in Louisiana and Mississippi just would not evacuate or evacuated against their better feelings because they didn't want to abandon their animals. 00;09;36;15 - 00;09;55;18 Scott Simon And so now evacuation orders have been have been changed so that you can bring along reasonably sized animals. And I think that just recognizes the obvious. They are they are members of the family. They're part of our lives. And to keep our own humanity going, we keep them in our lives, often under our arms and in our laps. 00;09;55;20 - 00;10;17;22 Jen Blackmer Absolutely. It was. It is it is such a delightful read. And as you say, you you move us from these moments of joy to moments perhaps not as much. I, I kind of felt, Scott, as I was reading the book, that I should be reading it aloud to my own pets. I have two huskies who watch over me in very much the same way you just described. 00;10;17;24 - 00;10;20;23 Scott Simon That sounds like they sound like they'd be a good audience. 00;10;20;23 - 00;10;24;06 Jen Blackmer I'm I know they would actually. 00;10;24;09 - 00;10;34;12 Scott Simon And and they probably enjoy chewing on the book when the reading was over. I hope that'll help sales! I I've been told the book is very toothsome, so. 00;10;34;12 - 00;10;42;28 Jen Blackmer Yeah. And it very well might and and Scott, what a pleasure this conversation has been this afternoon. Thank you so much. 00;10;43;01 - 00;10;45;02 Scott Simon Pleasure to talk to you again. Thank you. 00;10;45;04 - 00;10;57;21 Jen Blackmer Scott Simon is the host of Weekend Edition Saturday. He has a new book out called “Ulysses S Cats and Other Animals I Have Known,” available now. 00;10;57;24 - 00;11;00;02 Sean Ashcraft 00;11;00;04 - 00;11;22;27 Kara DuQuette Orchestra Indiana is the combined talents of the Muncie Symphony Orchestra and the Marion Philharmonic Orchestra. They merged in 2022, and last year, Yaniv Segal became the artistic director and principal conductor. You can hear and see his work at a concert this weekend. But before he takes the conductor's podium, he sat down with IPR’s Casey Alexander. 00;11;23;04 - 00;11;25;23 Casey Alexander First of all, it's so nice to have you here, Mr. Segal. 00;11;25;24 - 00;11;27;13 Yaniv Segal Sure. 00;11;27;15 - 00;11;33;17 Casey Alexander Tell me a little bit about your past, like how you got here and why you chose Orchestra Indiana over somewhere else. 00;11;33;18 - 00;11;44;00 Yaniv Segal Well, that's a that's a long winded question, perhaps, but thanks for having me. The path through a arts career is very varied and, not a straight line. 00;11;44;02 - 00;12;07;06 Yaniv Segal So I started out very young playing violin. My mother is a musician, retired violinist from the New York Philharmonic. My father is a violin maker. And so I didn't have much choice, I suppose, or my sister managed to escape. She played a little piano growing up, and now she she's an artist, but not a musician. And so always growing up, with music all around. 00;12;07;10 - 00;12;28;03 Yaniv Segal I sang at the Metropolitan Opera as a kid. I then got really lucky to win a role on the first national tour of The Secret Garden, and toured for a year when I was 11, turned 12 on the road in Detroit. I was even in Indianapolis for, I think, a week sometime in 1992. That's a long time ago. 00;12;28;05 - 00;12;48;08 Yaniv Segal I did some more theatrical stuff in New York as well, but I never stopped playing violin. It my violin was on tour with me, and my mom was teaching me, and, I also wrote music from a young age, so just, you know, lots of creative things. Then some time in college, my path turned more towards conducting. 00;12;48;10 - 00;13;13;05 Yaniv Segal I think that for a lot of people, me included, practicing is a struggle. And I think I started to love the violin more when I didn't have to practice many, many hours a day. And, I loved, the conducting nature of music is communication is involving people and bringing the what I think is some of the greatest works of art to life. 00;13;13;08 - 00;13;35;06 Yaniv Segal And so I really found that that was the way I was gravitating. And so I just started conducting, still still composing. Eventually I went to the University of Michigan, where I did graduate degrees in both conducting and composition. And, you know, since then have had great opportunities as the assistant conductor of the Naples Philharmonic in Florida. I worked assistant of the Detroit Symphony. 00;13;35;13 - 00;13;59;17 Yaniv Segal I've guest conducted all around the states and abroad as well. My both my parents are immigrants, so I've worked in Europe an amount, a fair amount. The nature of orchestras right now in this country, is pretty remarkable. Like there are orchestras everywhere and the level of musicians is is really high. And my mother came to hear one of my concerts somewhere in the States. 00;13;59;17 - 00;14;31;07 Yaniv Segal I don't remember where it was. And maybe New York. It can be a little bit insular. In the New York Philharmonic especially. It can be insular. And she said to me in all seriousness, “Wow you can make good music anywhere.” And I think, you know, she meant that as a compliment. And just to say, I she, I don't think she realized any more because she just, you know, played with one of the best groups in the world for so long with the best artists, that you can have quality experiences everywhere, and you want to have those experiences in local places. 00;14;31;10 - 00;14;55;24 Yaniv Segal And so I, for the past couple of years have been the music director of an orchestra in Salina, Kansas. I'm on faculty at the Robert McDuffie Center for Strings, which is an incredible strings institute attached to Mercer University in Macon, Georgia. And as of this year, I'm now the, the music director here in Muncie. And, you know, the job popped up and I thought, oh, this looks creative. 00;14;55;24 - 00;15;15;25 Yaniv Segal They're looking, you know, orchestra Indiana combined two orchestras. They're looking to to communicate with the community in a new way. And I sent my application and was lucky enough to pass the, I'll call it an inspection, but maybe it maybe it was an audition. You know, you come in for a week, you do a concert, you meet the board and stuff like that. 00;15;15;27 - 00;15;19;07 Yaniv Segal And I was lucky enough to to get this job, and so here we are. 00;15;19;10 - 00;15;34;14 Casey Alexander That's awesome. That's. I do agree with you that you can really make good music anywhere, especially out here in the Midwest. So for your upcoming show, In Search of Destiny, you open with an original composition. What can you tell me about your piece, “The Life That Breathes?” 00;15;34;15 - 00;15;52;22 Yaniv Segal Oh, yeah. Well, thanks. Yeah, that's. I'm really excited about this. Also, it's my birthday on the ninth, so I get to open the concert with my own music. When I, when I got the job and was told to, you know, design a season, I said, you know, “Is it okay if I include some of my own music? 00;15;52;22 - 00;16;10;25 Yaniv Segal I don't want to push that on anybody.” And they said, “Absolutely, you can do that.” And then when, we decided to collaborate with Taylor University on their chorale for the final concert, went up to visit the university campus and one of the spaces that Reed Spencer, their choral director, showed me is this atrium in their science building. 00;16;11;02 - 00;16;31;28 Yaniv Segal And I was like, wow, this is an amazing space. I can't wait to hear what like, this is going to be unusual. It'll be breaking that fourth wall and it's a very reverberant space. And I said, “Do you think I could do my my piece that I wrote last year that uses bells placed all around the audience. And in a space like this, you're going to have an amazing acoustic.” 00;16;31;28 - 00;17;00;15 Yaniv Segal And they said, “Absolutely.” So, this piece, got its idea in two different phases. The first was, during the pandemic when I was stuck at home, and thinking about ways to write music. We thought, okay, people have to be separated. Maybe the audience will be in the middle and the orchestra will be around. So I was already thinking of this idea of 360 space and call and response from different sections. 00;17;00;17 - 00;17;38;18 Yaniv Segal So I have a I had a couple of ideas written down from that time period. And then fast forward a few years later and I read this book by Daniel Mason called “North Woods,” which is dynamite book. I mean, it is it really inspired me to think about space, a place through time. Many times in books you follow characters, and instead he follows the space the, the book talked about this, growth of this early growth of a plant called a cotyledon. 00;17;38;21 - 00;18;03;10 Yaniv Segal Some plants have this embryonic leaf like, if you think of a pea shoot, for example, you have that those that that little shoot with a two leaves and those leaves nourish the seed early on and enable the plant to grow. But then it absorbs those leaves and that stem and, and they disappear. So I thought about this idea of how we absorb things into us and we come out different. 00;18;03;10 - 00;18;28;22 Yaniv Segal You don't you might not see those things anymore, but they become a part of the piece. So the piece is all about organic growth from one idea that that transforms into another and transforms into another and transform and so on and so forth, and eventually kind of celebrates the fact that light, the energy that we get from the sun, that goes into the plants, that goes into the animal that grows into us, is what enables life to exist. 00;18;28;24 - 00;18;37;11 Casey Alexander Nice. So how does that original piece really set the tone for the rest of the program? Because I know the rest of it's pretty classical stuff, but like, how does that set the tone there? 00;18;37;11 - 00;18;47;16 Yaniv Segal So I think bookended, since we start with my piece, which is very much about nature and growth and melody, not so much. 00;18;47;16 - 00;19;12;14 Yaniv Segal It's much more about a sound piece. And then we end with Debussy's Nocturnes, which is one of the earliest examples of a work that is about description of place. And creating sound worlds that are very unique. I think that that is why I wanted to pair those two, on the, on the outside, sorry, on the bookends of the program. 00;19;12;16 - 00;19;48;25 Yaniv Segal And then, the other ones explore destiny, fate, interaction with nature. So we're kind of, you know, on the edge of what we know and what we don't know. And some of the texts in some of the, poems that, were set to sound like the Vaughan Williams “Toward the Unknown Region,” you know, Walt Whitman is somebody who is really known for writing about nature and place and the poem and is really about what is it, what is in the great beyond. 00;19;48;28 - 00;19;58;24 Yaniv Segal So I think nature is a tying theme throughout. And also I was also thinking just musically about things that would sound great in that resonant space. 00;19;58;26 - 00;20;14;08 Casey Alexander Yeah. Speaking of sounding great in that resonant space, I mean, the Brahms, I can only imagine that powerful choir part, in, I guess, sung their parts and like, what? I've never worked with a choir before in an orchestra before, but, I've heard choirs in orchestras, and I think they add so much. 00;20;14;08 - 00;20;17;11 Casey Alexander How do you bring out the best in a choir? 00;20;17;14 - 00;20;37;22 Yaniv Segal I had the privilege of stopping in yesterday to hear their rehearsal. They’re fantastic. And that was, you know, you kind of don't know, early on when you're when you get a new job, what your partnerships are going to be like and I was hoping for for something good and I was even more surprised by how they sound and in their preparation. 00;20;37;28 - 00;21;02;17 Yaniv Segal So, the sound of singers in that space is one of the reasons I chose the space and and that Reed Spencer suggested it. And in Brahms, you know, he he makes the orchestra sound so rich and now add the human voice and, and the harmony. And I think that we're just going to be wrapped up in gorgeous sound. 00;21;02;20 - 00;21;15;16 Casey Alexander Yeah. So you are working with the fantastically talented Loralee Songer in the Alto Rhapsody. Can you talk about what she adds to that piece? And to the orchestra as a whole? 00;21;15;18 - 00;21;25;09 Yaniv Segal Yeah. So we also just met, I mean, we've we've met on a before, but we just met yesterday to go over the song and I almost had nothing to say to her. 00;21;25;09 - 00;21;37;20 Yaniv Segal Just, she was so delightful. And what. And she actually apologized. She said, oh, I'm sorry, I've been singing all day and my voice is shot. And I couldn't believe it. She's got a gorgeous instrument. 00;21;37;23 - 00;21;44;02 Casey Alexander Nice. And then how does ending on that impressionistic note impact the narrative? And how do you want people to walk away from this program? 00;21;44;10 - 00;21;46;21 Yaniv Segal Is it my job to decide how they walk away? 00;21;46;26 - 00;21;50;11 Casey Alexander No. But how do you walk away from this program? 00;21;50;13 - 00;22;19;23 Yaniv Segal I think we're we're all privileged. I mean, as a musician, sometimes you get caught up in the technical aspects or the preparation or the practice or the rehearsal, but I think it's really important to remember, and you're a young performer, that you're also allowed to be inspired and that the act of performing and living, that experience is really important for shaping us as a human being and for the audience as human beings. 00;22;19;25 - 00;22;44;15 Yaniv Segal I think what's amazing about live music is that you could be sitting next to somebody else and have completely different takeaways, and it depends on many things, you know, maybe what you had for breakfast, maybe. Maybe what, what type of day you've had getting to the hall, small annoyances, or maybe it reminds you of something. There. There are so many ways to experience a concert. 00;22;44;18 - 00;23;12;11 Yaniv Segal What I think my goal is as a performer is to create a space where people are allowed to disconnect from the rest of what is a very sometimes busy or stressful or seemingly, you know, life with with no quiet moments with our cell phones dinging with the notifications, with so many things going on at all times when you come to a concert, it's a it's a form of meditation. 00;23;12;11 - 00;23;38;09 Yaniv Segal You know, you're you should put away the phone. You should put away that outside world and allow yourself to listen. And if we do that, whatever you take away is that valid experience. If it if it means you need to just, you know, relax for a little bit, great. If if it means, wow, I loved that I'm going to go practice my flute because I want to do that. 00;23;38;11 - 00;23;47;21 Yaniv Segal You know, that's that's also that's also great. There's no ultimate goal like specific ultimate goal other than to have it to have an experience for everybody. 00;23;47;23 - 00;23;51;28 Casey Alexander Very nice. And when can people experience this? 00;23;52;00 - 00;24;12;07 Yaniv Segal Our concert this week is at 7:30 at Taylor University. You can get tickets at the door or on the Orchestra Indiana’s website. I would say they’re the campus is undergoing some construction right now, so parking is a little bit more complicated, and you might have a little bit of a walk to the, the science atrium. 00;24;12;09 - 00;24;18;27 Yaniv Segal So if you're coming, go ahead and plan early. And we would love to have a full house. 00;24;18;29 - 00;24;21;15 Casey Alexander The good news is that Saturday, the weather is supposed to be lovely. 00;24;21;16 - 00;24;21;26 Yaniv Segal Awesome. 00;24;21;26 - 00;24;24;26 Casey Alexander And so being in nature for a little bit longer can't hurt anybody. 00;24;24;27 - 00;24;29;18 Yaniv Segal And. Yeah, and then we'll bring the nature right into the concert hall and connect that as well. It's a beautiful campus. 00;24;29;20 - 00;25;02;20 Casey Alexander Yes. Thank you so much for joining us, Mr. Segal. We really appreciated the interview. Yaniv Segal is director of Orchestra Indiana. I'm Casey Alexander. 00;25;02;22 - 00;25;23;21 Jen Blackmer Welcome back to Pop of Culture. I'm Jen Blackmer, and today we're happy to bring you another installment of our series, Beautiful Things, in conjunction with River Teeth Journal of Nonfiction Narrative. And today, I am so happy to be speaking with author Kelly McMasters. Hello, Kelly. 00;25;23;24 - 00;25;25;17 Kelly McMasters Hi, Jen, thanks so much. 00;25;25;19 - 00;25;40;07 Jen Blackmer Kelly is an author of two memoirs, “The Leaving Season” and “Welcome to Shirley.” And today she's going to be sharing with us her beautiful thing called “The Inside of Bones.” 00;25;40;09 - 00;26;11;06 Kelly McMasters Thanks, Jen. “The Inside of Bones.” His small voice cuts a jagged line into the not quite morning quiet. My body reflexively lifts out of bed, finds its way over the piles of tiny cars and books through the stone darkness of our new apartment, our first without his father. I steer myself into the bedroom he shares with his younger brother, find his bed, crawl in. “Mama,” he repeats, 00;26;11;08 - 00;26;43;02 Kelly McMasters softer this time. His eyes are wide and staring. “What's inside my bones?” His body is taut beneath his duvet and the nightlight hollows his eyes gray. He is five. He loves ABBA, the beauty of photosynthesis, the number zero. I murmur about minerals and marrow, picturing the mealy silt sealed inside his spindle legs. He’s small for his age; can't yet tip the old brass scale past 38 pounds 00;26;43;02 - 00;27;13;10 Kelly McMasters at swim lessons. He is sharp-edged, ungraceful. Holding him feels like putting my arms around a folding chair. My hand rests on his sternum, thrumming with his heartbeat. He lightly moves it away. He weighs what I've given him fragments about blood cells and tissue. But it's enough for now. His body relaxes beside me and his breathing goes hard, like his brother's across the room. 00;27;13;12 - 00;27;31;00 Kelly McMasters I stare at him as the light shifts through the blinds. The translucent skin on his eyelids gives a faint ripple, the thin purple branches of blood vessels pulsing like a secret between us. What's inside your bones, sweet boy? I am. 00;27;31;02 - 00;27;38;23 Jen Blackmer What a lovely, lovely piece, Kelly. Thank you so much for the the piece and the and the great reading. 00;27;38;25 - 00;27;39;24 Kelly McMasters Thank you so much. 00;27;39;27 - 00;27;56;21 Jen Blackmer This is when I when I first read this a couple of days ago, I was struck by the moments, right? And I have three kids and I just think back to all of these private moments that I had with them. 00;27;56;23 - 00;28;16;26 Jen Blackmer Middle of the night, early morning, sitting in a chair together or, you know, these, these things that are kind of stamped onto my own soul that only I know. And this is this is your piece really allowed me to recall some of those. 00;28;16;28 - 00;28;29;01 Kelly McMasters Oh thank you. I mean, there's so many of those private moments. And one of the heartbreaks of motherhood, I think, is that my son would never remember that. 00;28;29;04 - 00;28;30;03 Jen Blackmer Right? Yes. 00;28;30;05 - 00;28;34;13 Kelly McMasters That's private between us and yet it's all mine. 00;28;34;18 - 00;28;46;27 Jen Blackmer Yeah, yeah. And you share it so beautifully. I think that, well, I'll ask you the usual question, I begin. I think it's probably a little obvious, but what inspired this piece for you? 00;28;46;29 - 00;29;13;20 Kelly McMasters So, this piece came, after we had just, I just left my marriage, and I took my two kids and moved to a completely new town where I knew nobody. We knew nobody. I had a new job. And we were in this beautiful and yet decrepit old, horse stable of an apartment. 00;29;13;22 - 00;29;14;05 Jen Blackmer Yeah. 00;29;14;05 - 00;29;31;06 Kelly McMasters And, we were in Lancaster, Pennsylvania, and, everything in those first few months felt I realized exactly like that moment. Just sort of dark and quiet and lonely. 00;29;31;08 - 00;29;32;05 Jen Blackmer Yeah. 00;29;32;08 - 00;29;46;07 Kelly McMasters I I felt through him in that question a lot of the things that I was feeling in that period. And so that was sort of what, what made me sit down and, and catalog that moment. 00;29;46;10 - 00;30;10;25 Jen Blackmer Those questions in particular, that our that our kids ask in these moments are so simple, but they're so revealing like this, this idea of what's in my bones, right? It's just a it's such a lovely question. And for him, I'm sure it was just a. “Yeah, I'm thinking about my bones right now.” 00;30;10;28 - 00;30;38;22 Kelly McMasters Yes. Middle of the night. Big questions for a little boy. And, you know, I'd been looking at him and his physicality in a particular way at that time. Because in that moment, they both - both of my children - seemed just so physically vulnerable more than at any other moment, and looking at him, you know, throwing his body into the water 00;30;38;22 - 00;31;02;10 Kelly McMasters at swim lessons at The Y every week. And we did. We had this giant brass scale. It was beautiful, at The Y. And every week he would stand on it hoping, hoping that he would, make that, arrow point higher and 38 pounds. I mean, I think my groceries that I bought yesterday were 38 pounds, right? 00;31;02;13 - 00;31;21;24 Kelly McMasters And I also wondered, how are we going to get through this? You're so small. How can I protect you? And I felt like his question “What's in my bones?,” the only thing I knew was that I was there, and I was going to help us, as much as possible, get through this next part. 00;31;21;26 - 00;31;50;25 Jen Blackmer Yeah. “Holding him feels like putting my arms around a folding chair.” That image is so wonderfully specific. And as our kids grow, they're kind of growing into their physical selves as well, which can be difficult for them. And, so that that in particular was, was very revealing about what you just spoke of. 00;31;50;27 - 00;32;19;10 Kelly McMasters Thank you. I think a lot of motherhood for me was spent feeling like I was doing something wrong or feeling the wrong thing, and not knowing how to do something as simple as hold my child. Sometimes felt like a failure. And I think a lot of what I explore in my book, “The Leaving Season,” and this part of this section did end up going into that book, 00;32;19;13 - 00;32;31;02 Kelly McMasters really talks about the loneliness of motherhood when you do think and I and what I understand now is it's pretty universal. You do think you're doing it wrong, and- 00;32;31;04 - 00;32;33;09 Jen Blackmer All the time! 00;32;33;12 - 00;32;34;03 Kelly McMasters All the time! 00;32;34;05 - 00;32;36;28 Jen Blackmer Every day, right? 00;32;37;00 - 00;33;06;10 Kelly McMasters But I was so, on my own in that period that I didn't have anyone really to check that with, and, you know, soon after I did come into this beautiful community of other mothers and, and that really helped. But at that moment, the reason I included that line is because it really did that that image occurred to me, and it felt almost wrong to confess that that's what holding my child felt like. 00;33;06;10 - 00;33;10;21 Jen Blackmer Exactly. Yeah. Because it's not a comfortable image, right? 00;33;10;23 - 00;33;17;10 Kelly McMasters No, no, it's not. And it did. It felt like a confession in this small flash piece. 00;33;17;15 - 00;33;37;13 Jen Blackmer Right? Right. “He loves ABBA, the beauty of photosynthesis, and the number zero.” The miracle of life comes to us through these vulnerable bodies that you talked about earlier with these very large questions like the number zero. There have been books written about that. 00;33;37;16 - 00;34;01;17 Kelly McMasters Exactly, exactly. And, and what you said earlier about the sort of middle of the night child questions and the way they are interpreting the world. And I think he could really have meant literally, what is inside my bone. I am this is mine, and I can't see it. Can you help me understand how I work? 00;34;01;19 - 00;34;03;07 Jen Blackmer Right. Yeah. 00;34;03;09 - 00;34;15;03 Kelly McMasters And that sort of larger in that beauty of zero, right? The larger questions of the universe, what's inside me. And I realized I know so little about my world. 00;34;15;03 - 00;34;16;07 Jen Blackmer Right. Yes. 00;34;16;11 - 00;34;28;08 Kelly McMasters I often didn't know the answer and so I would try and, you know, muddle through it. And this was one of those examples of my muddling where I'm trying to remember, you know, 8th grade biology. 00;34;28;08 - 00;34;28;16 Jen Blackmer Right? 00;34;28;19 - 00;34;40;00 Kelly McMasters And he, you know, he bought it for a period. I could tell it wasn't it wasn't exactly what he wanted or it wasn't enough, but it was enough for the moment. 00;34;40;02 - 00;35;04;09 Jen Blackmer Exactly. Yes. And our kids reveal to us what what we know, but also what we don't know. And it's this, this amazing sort of contradiction that we rest in when we're parents in in remembering that we're not complete. They think we are, but we're not. And how do we negotiate that with them on a on a daily basis I think. 00;35;04;11 - 00;35;24;24 Jen Blackmer Kelly McMasters is the author of two memoirs, “The Leaving Season” and “Welcome to Shirley,” and coeditor of “Wanting: Women Writing About Desire” and “This is the Place: Women Writing About Home.” A former bookstore owner, she teaches at Hofstra University and lives in New York. Thanks, Kelly. 00;35;24;26 - 00;35;26;11 Kelly McMasters Thanks so much. 00;35;26;14 - 00;35;46;10 Jen Blackmer This story comes from IPR’s collaboration with River Teeth's Beautiful Things, a weekly magazine of micro essays. More at River Teeth Journal Dot Com. 00;35;46;12 - 00;35;50;09 Kara DuQuette This week for What Are You Working On?, we hear from a painter. 00;35;50;10 - 00;35;57;20 Maya Doss My name is Maya Doss, and today on WAYWO, I have Nia Thomas, a painting major at Ball State. Nia, how are you? 00;35;57;20 - 00;35;59;24 Nia Thomas Hi. I'm good, I'm good. 00;35;59;25 - 00;36;03;21 Maya Doss So glad to have you with us today. Nia, what are you working on? 00;36;03;23 - 00;36;24;27 Nia Thomas I'm working on a 22x30. Just sheet of paper. And I am currently painting, like, a night scene. I'm going in with gouache, and I kind of wanted it to be a little bit more saturated, so, I'm starting off with a bunch of, like, brighter colors and, hoping to layer a lot of darker tones in over it. 00;36;25;00 - 00;36;29;25 Maya Doss That sounds beautiful. So when you're working with gouache, how would you explain that paint to our listeners? 00;36;29;27 - 00;36;46;17 Nia Thomas Yeah. So gouache, I would consider it to be a mix between like watercolor like an acrylic. It's kind of like in between type of paint. It can be really transparent, or you can also build up a lot of layers and have it be more pigmented or opaque, so. 00;36;46;20 - 00;36;50;06 Maya Doss That's awesome. With your night scene, what colors are you using? 00;36;50;12 - 00;36;57;22 Nia Thomas I'm just working with like oranges, reds. I'm really just getting that underpainting for 00;36;57;24 - 00;36;58;03 Maya Doss Gotcha. 00;36;58;07 - 00;37;00;06 Nia Thomas worked on, so. 00;37;00;08 - 00;37;03;21 Maya Doss That's exciting. And then what class is this for? 00;37;03;23 - 00;37;05;03 Nia Thomas It's for narrative painting. 00;37;05;06 - 00;37;11;24 Maya Doss And you said narrative painting is a more open medium class. Have you enjoyed getting to explore different forms of paint for different projects? 00;37;11;24 - 00;37;31;02 Nia Thomas Yeah. Yeah, it's been really fun to have that open. I've been working with gouache as like an underpainting, and I think I did my first painting in open acrylic, which is like a slow-drying acrylic paint. And then, I think for the most recent two, I've done oil paint, so. 00;37;31;02 - 00;37;32;19 Maya Doss What would you say is your favorite? 00;37;32;20 - 00;37;35;01 Nia Thomas I would say oil paint for sure. 00;37;35;08 - 00;37;40;17 Maya Doss And I remember you bringing up that you had done some wax painting. Is it called encaustics? 00;37;40;25 - 00;37;42;08 Nia Thomas Yes, encaustics, yeah. 00;37;42;08 - 00;37;43;01 Maya Doss How was that? 00;37;43;02 - 00;38;01;05 Nia Thomas Oh my gosh, it's such a fun experience. It's so different as a medium. It's like there's like such a large learning curve when working with it. It's a new medium for me, so I'm still learning it. But for me, I feel like it was best to work fast because it dries so quickly, 00;38;01;07 - 00;38;10;13 Maya Doss but the pigment and the color variations and, just the process of working with it is a lot of fun. I really enjoy it. 00;38;10;15 - 00;38;22;13 Maya Doss When it came to some of the pieces you had made with the wax painting process, one that really stood out to me was the octopus, because I had lots of little textured marks. How did you go about making something like that? 00;38;22;14 - 00;38;41;03 Nia Thomas While I was in the in caustics class, I was also in a printmaking class, and so I was my theme in the printmaking class was more of marine life or like sea life. And so I pretty much just reference the sketch that I use for printmaking. I think I started off with wanting to do more saturated tones. 00;38;41;03 - 00;39;12;25 Nia Thomas I feel like with sea Life there's like so much opportunity to use like brighter colors. And so yeah, I started out with, some sort of wash, like a dark green. I did like greens, reds, and orange is my favorite color, so I did the octopus orange, of course. But yeah, I laid out the background. And then I, I started off with a sketch, but, I laid out the background left in those spaces for, the color of the octopus, and I did this- 00;39;12;25 - 00;39;16;04 Maya Doss Which is like a vibrant yellow and orange. 00;39;16;07 - 00;39;24;20 Nia Thomas Yeah, yeah. It's like, it's got, like, a really rich, like, warm tone to it. I use reds, oranges, yellows. 00;39;24;20 - 00;39;45;12 Maya Doss And for our listeners, you can kind of see the octopus's head and body. And then there's like these twirling tentacles and you can see all the suction cups, and she did a really beautiful job laying details on with the wax. Would you say that was one of the more challenging mediums that you found rewarding, or what was your favorite kind of class that had a learning curve? 00;39;45;13 - 00;40;08;23 Nia Thomas Yeah, I would definitely say encaustics for sure. Yeah, I had never worked with like a medium like comparable to it, especially in the process of like having to work within a time frame of the, the pigment drying, and so, for me, it was so fun to have to work fast and really lock in and put in my attention into, what I was working on, so. 00;40;08;26 - 00;40;24;06 Maya Doss I thought that your work really shown through that medium because your paintings are abstracted and colorful and vibrant, and for some reason, with the wax, I felt like it just really embodied that vibe really well. 00;40;24;06 - 00;40;24;25 Nia Thomas Yeah. 00;40;24;27 - 00;40;36;02 Maya Doss Other works of yours I really loved, which you did do an encaustic self-portrait, but I've loved your painting self-portraits. Can you talk to us about what inspires what you paint and why you paint what you do? 00;40;36;05 - 00;40;44;29 Nia Thomas I feel like in the creative world, I'm inspired by just the mundane of everyday life. I feel like it really just depends. 00;40;45;00 - 00;40;46;28 Maya Doss That's what I love about artistic people though. 00;40;47;03 - 00;41;18;13 Nia Thomas Yeah, so a lot of my different paintings kind of reflect like a time and place of when I've had different experiences or different spaces that have made me sort of like reflect. I feel like it's very experimental. I feel like it's really a space for me to sort of like emotionally process, like life experiences, but also just like environmental aspects of like places that I immerse myself into. 00;41;18;15 - 00;41;37;22 Nia Thomas I do a lot of paintings of my mom also, because she's very close to me. I also do a lot of things that, are relative to like me personally in a very mundane way, like kind of like a day-to-day, but things that cause me to reflect in, in a sense. Yeah. 00;41;37;24 - 00;41;41;29 Maya Doss Nia, what is one of your favorite pieces you've ever created? 00;41;42;01 - 00;42;15;18 Nia Thomas One of my favorite pieces I've ever made is, titled “Apartment Life.” I would describe it as a sort of, like, dystopian space that, has really rich, like, red tones and yellow tones. I painted, this sort of ominous sort of, red and orange sky with these two buildings on the left and right side of the painting. In the center are these really pretty flowers that sort of they kind of like make a path in between these buildings. 00;42;15;20 - 00;42;41;04 Nia Thomas And I had a lot of fun making this painting. I feel like I use a lot of different techniques, like impasto and dry brushing, and, it was one of my first experiences using acrylic. I had been more experienced with using watercolor, but, after taking the materials class, I felt like I was a little bit more comfortable using it. 00;42;41;04 - 00;43;06;17 Nia Thomas And so there's just so many different pretty details that I included in this and I feel like it's it's just really interesting. I felt like the process of making it was a lot of fun. And, I feel like it definitely reflected just my life at the time, just being new to even living in an apartment and just just everyday actions, having that as sort of like a reflection. 00;43;06;20 - 00;43;13;11 Maya Doss I think that's beautiful. I love that piece, as well. If our listeners wanted to see your artwork for themselves, where could they go? 00;43;13;14 - 00;43;27;11 Nia Thomas Yeah. So you could follow me on Instagram. My tag is @goldennngloo with three N's and two O's. That's my main platform. 00;43;27;16 - 00;43;32;09 Maya Doss That's amazing. I really appreciate you taking time out of your busy student schedule to go and talk with me Nia. 00;43;32;13 - 00;43;41;15 Nia Thomas Yeah. Thank you. This has been such a great opportunity to even talk about my art, so. 00;43;41;17 - 00;43;47;26 Jen Blackmer The weekend after graduation is always a quiet time, but there's still plenty to do in East Central Indiana, Kara. 00;43;47;28 - 00;43;48;09 Kara DuQuette Yep. 00;43;48;09 - 00;44;04;25 Jen Blackmer This is the Arts Calendar. Orchestra Indiana's next concert, “In Search of Destiny,” is on Saturday, May 9th. It starts with an original work from artistic director Yaniv Segal, who you heard earlier in today's show, titled “The Light That Breathes.” 00;44;04;27 - 00;44;18;24 Jen Blackmer It will set the stage for a powerful exploration of purpose and transcendence. The concert takes place at Euler Science Complex at Taylor University again on Saturday, May 9th. The search begins at 7:30 p.m.. 00;44;18;27 - 00;44;32;20 Kara DuQuette Also on Saturday, May 9th, the Delaware County Master Gardener Association will have their annual Spring Plant Sale. Browse through a wide selection of trees, shrubs, perennials, annuals, and more. 00;44;32;22 - 00;44;35;01 Jen Blackmer Flowers. Flowers everywhere. 00;44;35;01 - 00;44;35;14 Kara DuQuette Yes. 00;44;35;14 - 00;45;00;13 Jen Blackmer It’s the last weekend to take in Flowers Forever at the Indiana State Museum, where flowers are everywhere. Painted, framed in patterns, bunched into bouquets, this exhibit of art and artifacts explores the nuances of floral motifs in art and design across time. Tickets can be arranged at Indiana Museum Dot Org. 00;45;00;16 - 00;45;28;23 Kara DuQuette And we'll have more on another floral function in just a moment. This Wednesday, learn about lesser known Indiana artist Constance Coleman Richardson, the director of Ball State School of Art and Pop of Culture alum Doctor Laura Kuykendall will lead a tea and talk at Minnetrista Museum & Gardens. She'll talk about Richardson's place in art history and why rediscovering overlooked artistic voices matters in present day. 00;45;28;26 - 00;45;38;27 Kara DuQuette This Wednesday, May 13th at 3 p.m. Pre-registration is preferred. More information at Minnetrista Dot Org Slash Events. 00;45;38;29 - 00;45;43;16 Jen Blackmer Also, don't forget that Mother's Day is Sunday. 00;45;43;17 - 00;45;44;09 Kara DuQuette Mom. 00;45;44;09 - 00;46;06;21 Jen Blackmer Mom. Looking ahead on her calendar, we have several events for next weekend, including Art in Bloom, again, more flowers, at the David Owsley Museum of Art or DOMA. This annual celebration of innovative floral creations is open to the public. Saturday, May 16th and Sunday, May 17th with extended museum hours. 00;46;06;23 - 00;46;24;18 Jen Blackmer There's also a preview party next Friday, May 15th from 5 to 7 p.m.. Get a first look at this year's arrangements, along with music, tasty beverages, TM, and hors d'Oeuvres. Event details are at B-S-U Dot E-D-U Slash D-O-M-A. 00;46;24;21 - 00;46;50;27 Kara DuQuette Also next weekend, an opportunity to do some arts and crafts. There will be a zines workshop at the Eagles Theater in Wabash. Zines are handmade self-published mini magazines rooted in underground art culture. The content inside can be anything. Supplies will be provided. This workshop is Saturday, May 16th. It's open to the public, but space is limited. Learn more at Honeywell Arts Dot Org. 00;46;51;01 - 00;46;52;20 Jen Blackmer Yeah, zines takes me back. 00;46;52;21 - 00;46;53;08 Kara DuQuette Oh yeah. 00;46;53;08 - 00;47;24;23 Jen Blackmer Zines takes me back to I don't know when I was a teenager, rebellious teenager. And finally, Muncie Ballet will present “Oz the Ballet.” This adventurous show is filled with dancing and a rainbow of costumes, of course, and is intended for the full family. The ballet commences at Cornerstone Center for the Arts on Friday, May 15th at 7 p.m. and Saturday, May 16th at 2 p.m. Tickets can be found at Berriwinkle Frozen Yogurt and Rosebud Coffeehouse. 00;47;24;25 - 00;47;36;24 Kara DuQuette If you have something adventurous for our Arts Calendar, dance your fingers along the keyboards to Indiana Public Radio Dot Org Slash Contact and then click Pop of Culture. 00;47;36;26 - 00;47;56;01 Luke Jones Support for Pop of Culture comes from Stallings Wealth Management and from you. You may have heard about large gifts to NPR. Those donations are important, but they don't bring back the funding to IPR. Your support pays for the programs you rely on, especially local programs like this one, 00;47;56;07 - 00;48;07;12 Sean Ashcraft and the people, like me, who create them. Pop of Culture exists for you and because of you. Give today at Indiana Public Radio Dot Org. 00;48;07;14 - 00;48;12;28 Kara DuQuette And that's our show. Our Interim General Manager and Executive Producer is Angie Grimes. 00;48;13;00 - 00;48;22;10 Jen Blackmer This week was produced by Luke Jones, who for Mother's Day this year will give his mother the gift of leaving her alone so she can finish her book. 00;48;22;13 - 00;48;25;24 Kara DuQuette We had production assistance from Andrew Montavon. 00;48;25;26 - 00;48;31;09 Jen Blackmer Our audio fellow is Maya Doss, and our show was hosted by me, Jen Blackmer. 00;48;31;09 - 00;48;38;16 Kara DuQuette And me, Kara Duquette. Pop of Culture is a production from IPR on the flowery campus of Ball State University.